Dear Infertility_S5_Ep7 - Dr. Angela Holliday-Bell: Audio automatically transcribed by Sonix

Dear Infertility_S5_Ep7 - Dr. Angela Holliday-Bell: this mp3 audio file was automatically transcribed by Sonix with the best speech-to-text algorithms. This transcript may contain errors.

Kristyn Hogdon:
Hi, I'm Kristyn Hodgdon, an IVF mom, proud women's health advocate, and co-founder of Rescripted. Welcome to Dear (In)fertility. This season join me along with a variety of women's health experts as we explore holistic approaches to our reproductive, hormonal, sexual, mental, and overall health and wellness. From the practice of cycle syncing to the importance of pelvic floor therapy, we'll address some of the many questions women have about their bodies and share practical tips for improving your day-to-day life. Now, let's dive in and work towards ending the shame and stigma surrounding women's bodies once and for all, from first period to last period.

Kristyn Hogdon:
Hi, everyone, and welcome back to Dear Infertility. I'm your host, Kristyn, and I'm here today with Dr. Angela Holliday-Bell. Hi, Dr. Holliday-Bell!

Dr. Angela Holliday-Bell:
Hello, Kristyn! Thank you so much for having me. I'm so excited to talk to you today.

Kristyn Hogdon:
Of course! I'm so excited to have you. So for those of you who don't know her, Dr. Angela Holliday-Bell is a certified sleep specialist, a board-certified pediatrician, a coach, and a speaker, and she basically is an expert in all things sleep. Since we spend, what is it, a third of our lives sleeping, we thought that we couldn't talk about health and wellness this season without talking about healthy sleep habits. So welcome, and my first curiosity is just like, how did you get into sleep as a specialty? I know you're a pediatrician, but.

Dr. Angela Holliday-Bell:
Yeah, that's a great question and one that I'm always asked. I like to say I've always had a deep, loving relationship with sleep. I'm always someone who needed a lot of sleep and loved to sleep in general, but as I'm sure you could imagine, going through medical training, medical school, residency, sleep came, became harder and harder to get. And it initially started with me not having enough time to sleep, and then, even when I had the time, I just could not sleep for the life of me, so I had a really significant bout of insomnia, especially in residency, and it just made me a completely different person. I was on edge all the time, I was not happy, I did not have energy, I had headaches, I just felt like I was not the best version of myself, and so it really started with my own quest to be like, okay, I need to fix this. This is not how I want to show up for myself or my patients every day. And so I started volunteering in the sleep clinic, in my hospital, and read every single book there was on sleep and then really fell in love with sleep and really realized how important it was beyond just feeling rested and that it really is necessary to function optimally in every facet of life. And once I started putting certain practices into place in my own sleep life and saw how that changed me for the better, I was like, oh, I have to tell other people about this. Like other people have struggles, and I need to help them. So I actually started a blog during my residency just to get the word out there. I started helping my patients sleep because, as we know, infants, toddlers, adolescents, so on, whatever, are not getting sleep, and then that turned into friends and family, and then friends and patients, and it became this bigger thing; and it's just something that I'm so in love with and so passionate about that I was like, okay, this needs to be its own separate thing. I became certified as a sleep specialist, certified in cognitive behavioral therapy for insomnia, and then the rest is history.

Kristyn Hogdon:
Wow, that's awesome. So were you working nights when you were in residency? Is that why you got messed up, or was it just like your, you had such a busy schedule?

Dr. Angela Holliday-Bell:
Yeah, I'd like to say one of the worst things you can do for your sleep is become a doctor, because it, really everything that you shouldn't do is what you have to do. So it was a mixture of, we're working 80-hour weeks, and then we work night shift, two-day shift, and then there are 24 to 36-hour shifts where you're up the entire time, and you're constantly working back and forth, and so it really is just the worst thing you can do for your sleep. So all of the above were reasons that I struggled.

Kristyn Hogdon:
That sort of messes with the whole circadian rhythm thing, right? Just curious, how did you fix your own sleep?

Dr. Angela Holliday-Bell:
Yeah, so it really started with my mindset, and I think it's such a trendy thing to say right now, but it's so true because I had to start by prioritizing sleep. And so for me, it was like, I'm so busy, I have so much going on, whenever I sleep, I'll get to it. So I'm going to come home and do notes. I'm going to stay up and watch my shows because I haven't had much time to myself, and then I'll get to sleep when I get to it. And I really had to turn that upside down, and it was like, no, how can you start the day off in a way that prepares you for ...? And so I made my time to sleep a very like sacred time. Even when I'm working very long hours, if I only had 7, which for me is low, I need 9. Even if I only had 7 hours that I could sleep, I was going to sleep those 7 hours. So really preparing with that in mind, saying this is a time that I'm not going to allow any other activities to get in the way of this. And then other strategies that I'm sure we'll talk about limiting caffeine and limiting engaging in stimulating activities before bed, really working on my stress and anxiety management, especially as a resident throughout the day and as I get closer to bedtime, but I would say the biggest thing was just that mindset shift. And like sleep is a priority, these hours that I need to sleep will be sacred, and then I will have to allow everything else to fall into place around.

Kristyn Hogdon:
Yeah, no, that's such an important point for sure. What's the deal with caffeine use? What shift did you have to make there?

Dr. Angela Holliday-Bell:
Yeah, I am a coffee lover, an avid coffee lover; it's like the second love of my life besides sleep. And my husband is like a third, he's like, right up there. But the thing with caffeine is that I have a long half-life, and half-life is the amount of time it takes for half of the amount to be excreted from your system, and that half-life is about 5 hours. So after 5 hours, half of the amount of caffeine you consumed is still in your system, and after 10 hours, you still have a quarter in your system. So what that means is, if you're drinking caffeine too close to bedtime, you can definitely still be enough in your system to either stop you from falling asleep or keep you in the lighter stages of sleep and lead to more broken sleep. So I had to shift the way that I was consuming that, doing that closer to the morning time, limiting the dose to the lowest necessary dose. And I'm actually someone that like caffeine, doesn't even, it doesn't affect me as much as it does a lot of other people, but I have to realize that it likely was contributing to me being in a lighter stage of sleep, more than not being able to fall asleep at all. So I really had to shift the amount that I was taking, but then also making that earlier and then relying on sleep to get me through the day as opposed to relying on caffeine to get me through the day.

Kristyn Hogdon:
Absolutely. That's interesting about the half-life. You said you need 9 hours personally; how does someone figure out how many they need?

Dr. Angela Holliday-Bell:
That's also a great question because that is something I really dig my feet in on, and that is that sleep need is like shoe size. There's no one-size-fits-all. The average is 7 to 8 hours, we've all heard that, but some people like myself need 9. Some people need, there are some people who need 6, that's rare. Most people will be 7, 8, 9, and some people even up to 10 hours, so it really is important to determine what that need is for you. How do you go about doing that? So my favorite way to do that and something I think that everyone should do at some point, at least once in their lives, even if you have a good idea of what your sleep need is, taking something called a sleepcation, and that is a vacation that is based solely around your sleep and listening to your body's own needs. So ideally, this will be a period of time of about 5 to 7 days where you don't have any other time ..., so you're not waking up for work or waking up for childcare activities. It's like a vacation, but you're really focusing on relaxation and sleep. You allow your body to fall asleep naturally around the time it normally would. So I am also a night owl, in addition to needing a lot of sleep, so naturally, I have to get sleepy later. And then, you allow yourself to wake up without an alarm, without anything else that's waking you up. Now, the first few days, and the reason that it needs to be more than that is that you'll be sleeping off sleep debt. So the amount of sleep that you've missed out on during the week accumulates, and your body tries to pay that back. So if I need 9 hours and I slept 6 hours, I've accumulated 3 hours of sleep debt that night. Of course, there's a caveat, you're not going to sleep for 24 hours straight because you built up on this debt, but your body will sleep longer than your sleep initially. But after a few nights, you'll find that you're falling into this rhythm where you're falling asleep and waking up around the same time, and that amount of time generally is representative of your sleep.

Kristyn Hogdon:
Wow, first of all, I would love a sleepcation. That sounds lovely. So personally, I love sleep. I never have trouble falling asleep. I never have trouble staying asleep or falling back asleep. Like, I'm definitely one of the lucky ones in that category. What's interesting is that I could sleep between, I could sleep probably up to 9 hours comfortably. But it's interesting what you said about the deficit, because I never know if I'm in a deficit when I actually do sleep that long. But sometimes, if I only sleep 7 hours, I actually wake up less groggy. So can you explain that? Because so, sometimes I think to myself, is 7 actually the amount I need because I actually wake up more energetic than when I get 9? I almost feel like it's harder to, just exhausted mode.

Dr. Angela Holliday-Bell:
Yeah, what you're describing is a phenomenon called sleep inertia, and that's that groggy, disoriented theory that you sometimes get when you wake up, and there are a few different things that cause that. So if you are awakened from a deeper stage of sleep, you're more likely to have sleep inertia because you haven't had, your brain does not in a light enough stage, and so it takes more time to come out of that. There is a thought that you can quote unquote oversleep, meaning if you overshoot your true sleep me by too much, you are also more likely to experience sleep inertia. So you likely are someone who needs truly 7 hours, and if you built up enough sleep debt, yes, you can sleep longer, but you're probably overshooting that. You're probably in the deeper stages of sleep, and it's harder for you to come out of. That's also another reason why it's good to know what your number is. Sometimes, I can definitely sleep longer than 9 hours, but I really try to keep it within that window because it can affect my performance a little bit. Some people are more vulnerable to sleep inertia than others, so some can sleep longer and are perfectly fine, and others a little bit longer it can cause that. But yes, if you sleep longer, especially much longer than your true sleep neeed, it can cause sleep inertia.

Kristyn Hogdon:
Yeah, so when I do wake up at 7 hours, it's usually because either my kids woke me up or I just woke up on my own. And that kind of explains that because it's like my body naturally woke me up versus, then I'll then sometimes I'll fall back asleep, and then that's when I wake up groggy or 2 hours later.

Dr. Angela Holliday-Bell:
Yeah, exactly, exactly. So when your body's naturally waking you up, it's naturally coming from that lighter stage of sleep, so it's like in between sleep cycles. Whereas if you're going back into a sleep cycle, you're more likely to wake up, and your refreshed, and you don't need more sleep; you're more likely to wake up from a deeper stage, and that can cause that sleep inertia.

Kristyn Hogdon:
Wow, okay. And do you recommend going to bed and waking up at the same time every night and morning?

Dr. Angela Holliday-Bell:
I do, and most importantly, waking up at the same time every morning. So that was another game changer for me. Although my schedule changed a lot in residency, when I had a consistent schedule, so like, for four weeks at a time, typically, for the most part, the schedule was consistent, I was waking up at the same time every day, and that's because that is the best way to reinforce your circadian rhythm. So your circadian rhythm is at roughly 24 hours cycle that dictates when you feel awake and alert and when you feel sleepy throughout the day. And so it sends factors and alerting cues to say, hey, you need to be awake and alert and up. And then melatonin is released later at night, closer to your bedtime to say, okay, it's time to go to bed. And so, the best way to ensure that those signals and those factors are sent at the times that you want, and at the same time is to keep your schedule as consistent as possible. Waking up at the same time, in particular, is going to be the best way to do that. You should also aim for a consistent bedtime, but the reason that waking up is more important than going to sleep at the same time is that if you're not sleepy or you can't sleep, you should not go to bed. So if you are nearing your bedtime and you're like not sleepy or wired, or you have something else going on, you should actually not go to sleep until you feel sleepy enough to fall asleep. But no matter what, waking up at the same time is very important.

Kristyn Hogdon:
Interesting, okay. And so, what are some of the most common reasons or complaints from women or men that can't sleep or have trouble sleeping? Is it like full-blown insomnia or are there, or is it interrupted sleep, or all of the above?

Dr. Angela Holliday-Bell:
Yeah, there's a mix, and there's a little bit of all the above. So people have trouble falling asleep, staying asleep, waking up earlier than intended. I would say one thing, the thing I'll probably get the most is people waking up in the middle of the night. So I call it the 3 a.m. club because it always seems to occur around 3 a.m. for most people. They wake up at 3 a.m. and can't go back to sleep, and they do a number of things trying to either force themselves to go back to sleep or they scroll through my phone, or I turn on Netflix, and then after a couple hours, I'll fall back asleep, and then, now it's time to wake up. And it's super common, and one thing I try to, first get people to understand is that waking up in the middle of the night is not a problem. We cycle through different sleep cycles throughout the night, so your average 8-hour sleep window will include about five different sleep cycles. And so you cycle from a light stage of sleep to a deeper stage of sleep to the REM or dream sleep back to the light stage, deep stage, and so on. And in between the light, the REM sleep, and the light stage is a brief awakening. So most of the time, that means we're adjusting ourselves. We might flip the pillow over, we might pull the comforter off a little bit, and we may not recognize that we're awake, but we're awake, and that's okay. The problem comes when you can't fall back asleep and when you engage in activities that cause you to be more stimulated such that it's more difficult to combat. And so something that caused that to happen, having to get up to urinate in the middle of the night, is normal to do. However, there are things that you can do to make that more likely to happen. So drinking fluids too close to bedtime, alcohol, and coffee, or alcohol and caffeine are both diuretics, meaning you're more, they make you produce more urine, so you're more likely to wake up, engaging in stimulating activities during that time. So probably the number one thing that people do that they think is helpful, but it's not, is getting up and getting on their phone, or getting on Netflix, or eating. What they do actually by doing that is reinforce that awakening. So I said it's important to wake up at the same time every day because it teaches your body that's what you want to wake up. If you wake up and you start doing stimulating activities that causes those alerting factors to be sick, you're teaching your body that you want to be awake at 3 a.m. So they're like, okay, at 3 a.m. is when we wake up and watch television, and we're getting all that blue light, so this must be the time we want to wake up; so you're reinforcing it, you're teaching your body that's when you want to be awake. Or if you go and have a snack, your body becomes hungry at that time, it starts to send digestive enzymes because it's like this at 3 a.m. is when we eat, so it's more likely to keep ... up. So the best way to manage that is if you wake up and you can't fall back asleep within 15 to 20 minutes, it's better to get out of your bed, do a low-stimulating activity, something like reading a book, folding clothes under low light, like something that is low stimulating, until you get sleepy again, and then we get sleepy, get back into the bed, and that will help to break that cycle over time.

Kristyn Hogdon:
I love that. Yeah, my aunt is always saying how she's up at 3 a.m., and I don't know what she does during that time, but I have to pass that on to her for sure. And then what about full-blown insomnia, which is my nightmare?

Dr. Angela Holliday-Bell:
You're, listen, you're so lucky that you have not dealt with that, that is really special gift for you. But full-blown insomnia is defined as difficulty falling asleep, staying asleep, or waking up earlier than intended, at least three nights per week or at least three months, so that's chronic insomnia. And when it comes to that, it typically is deeper than just having some caffeine too close to bedtime or not waking up at the same time. Those things are part of it, and they help to build a foundation upon which healthy sleep is built. But by the time someone is suffering from chronic insomnia, they've typically built up these negative thoughts and emotions surrounding sleep that trigger this anxiety and hyperarousal that is actually the thing that's causing them to be awake more than anything else. So, for instance, there are some people who will be like so tired, eyes closing when they're sitting on a couch or actually falling asleep on the couch, and they're like, I am just like, I can't keep myself up, I'm exhausted. And as soon as they get into the bed, it's like a light switch flips, and they're anxious, and the heart is racing, and now they're alert, and that's because they've now they've taught themselves that the sleep is a battle, and the bed is a battle. And so instead of it being this soothing process that you can have to fall into, it becomes this anxiety-ridden process. And if, oh no, now I'm going to struggle to fall asleep again, and I'm going to toss and turn, and I'm going to be exhausted tomorrow. So it really comes down to these negative cognitions that then have all these downstream effects. And then they further get into this cycle, and then, now I have to have ten cups of coffee because I'm so tired trying to get through the night, and I'm napping for too long. So then there are all these things that feed into the cycle, but it really comes down to those maladaptive cognitions and then the behaviors from that. So when I have someone who's suffering from chronic insomnia, we actually undergo cognitive behavioral therapy for insomnia in which we identify those thoughts, we help to reframe them and replace them with more realistic thoughts, and then, we work on the behaviors that occur subsequently to that. In addition, we work on restricting their sleep. So oftentimes, people with chronic insomnia spend too much time in bed, not sleeping. So they'll say, okay, I didn't sleep at all last night, I'm struggling, I'm just going to go to bed an hour or two earlier today. But then that means that they're just in bed for 1 or 2 more hours, tossing and turning, not falling asleep, and now they've connected their bed with being awake as opposed to sleep. So in order to break that connection, we restrict the amount of time they spend in bed to match the amount of time they actually spend sleeping while we repair those thoughts that they have surrounding sleep, and then, we slowly increase the amount of time in bed. And that helps to break the cycle of waking up in the middle of the night, staying up, not being able to fall asleep, and it really just reshapes their relationship with sleep and the bed.

Kristyn Hogdon:
I mean, so often, I feel like the one situation where I have trouble falling back asleep or falling asleep is when I know I have to be up for the airport at 5 a.m. because then your mind plays tricks on you. You're like, I don't, how am I? I need to get X amount of hours of sleep, and I can't sleep. That's so helpful, thank you. So we always like to look at things from like a women's health lens specifically, and I know that certain stages of the menstrual cycle, like your sleep, can be impacted. How does all that work?

Dr. Angela Holliday-Bell:
Yes. So for most women, it's right before their period starts that menstruation starts, that their sleep is affected. And the reason is that progesterone is a very important hormone for sleep, so it actually plays a part in deep sleep and sleep continuity, so being able to remain asleep, and it drops right before menstruation. So oftentimes, women will struggle with insomnia for a very, in varying levels, or to varying degrees right before their periods start. And so I like to help women to identify that, understand it, and prepare for it as much as possible. So there's not much we can do about the changes and shifts in our hormones, but if you know that's coming, you can bolster your sleep around it to protect you from that as much as possible. So making sure you're really on track with your sleep schedule, waking up at the same time, trying to go to sleep at the same time, having a good bedtime and wind down routine to manage any stress or anxiety that may also be contributing to difficulty falling asleep. Using certain supplements like magnesium, glycinate is probably my favorite, and that is helpful for a host of processes throughout the body, but in particular, sleep, and helping to get you into a deeper sleep, so better quality sleep, so using that around that time. Strategic power napping is great. So if there are times that I know I'm not going to be able to get sleep for whatever reason, I have to be a much earlier than normal, or I have, I call it an anticipation anxiety, so not a negative anxiety, it's something I'm looking forward to, but I'm worked up, so it's hard to fall asleep, I will implement strategic napping. You have to do it responsibly and do it in the right way, but that is a way to recover from a poor night of sleep in a way that shouldn't mess with your sleep the next night. So it's really understanding that and not allowing that time to then throw off the rest of your sleep cycle, and then you're trying to catch up from longer than just a couple of days. It's just dealing with it the best way you can and then getting right back on track.

Kristyn Hogdon:
Awesome. Are there any dietary or lifestyle changes that can help promote better sleep, aside from being mindful of your caffeine intake?

Dr. Angela Holliday-Bell:
Yeah. So being mindful of your caffeine intake, of course. Alcohol consumption is very important to be aware of. Oftentimes people use alcohol wine as a nightcap, and that is because alcohol tends to make you sleepy initially. So it is initially a sedative, but it's broken down very quickly, and after it's broken down, it becomes stimulant, and so it leads to broken sleep, so you're more likely to have middle of the night and early morning waking when you drink alcohol before bed, so being mindful of that. We tend to recommend limiting that within 3 to 4 hours of bedtime. In addition, being mindful of what and when you eat in terms of dinner and a bedtime snack before bed. Your larger meals, so dinner, should really also be about 3 to 4 hours before bedtime because if it's too close, it causes your digestive system to be active during a time when it should be less active for you to fall asleep. Limiting that, but incorporating a healthy bedtime snack can help your sleep, something that's rich in protein and complex carbs, like a Greek yogurt with berries and nuts, it's excellent about an hour before bedtime. The protein helps to keep you satiated so that you're not waking up from hunger pangs overnight. The complex carbs help to stabilize your blood sugar so you're not seeing the drops in blood sugar that can also wake you up overnight, and so it just helps to improve your sleep quality. Things rich in magnesium, so again, nuts are rich in magnesium, and then there are certain foods and beverages that are also rich in melatonin, or it can help melatonin production. So people probably heard of this tart cherry juice craze that has been a thing recently. There have been some promising studies to show that it's pretty high in melatonin. Kiwis are actually pretty high, walnuts, as I mentioned, and then milk. There's a reason for that like warm milk thing that you see/hear about is that it actually can help with melatonin production as long as you're not lactose intolerant, of course. So those are all things that you can incorporate into a healthy nighttime routine that can promote better, deeper quality.

Kristyn Hogdon:
That's funny. I didn't know about the milk thing, but when I do wake up hungry, if ever in the middle of the night, I usually just have a glass of milk, and then I can go back to sleep.

Dr. Angela Holliday-Bell:
Your subconscious leading you to the right ...

Kristyn Hogdon:
Yes, exactly. So I know so many people have those fitness trackers now, like Apple Watch or Aura ring. Are you a fan of those for tracking sleep? Are you, do you think it's good to be wearing a device while you sleep? Like, how does that work?

Dr. Angela Holliday-Bell:
Yeah, I am a fan if they're users. So it all comes down to that, right? I think it is helpful to track your behavior surrounding sleep and to track the trends surrounding sleep, right? So you may pick up the fact that, oh, when I had a glass of wine, my sleep was more broken, or I woke up earlier, that's interesting. Or, oh, I see a ... I'm tired, but I look back at my tracker, and I'm getting 6.5 hours on average, as opposed to the 7, seven and a half, that I know I need. Helping people to be mindful of their sleep and think about their sleep in a way they hadn't before, I think is actually great, and I love it for that reason. What I don't love it as much for, though, are some of the details that it tries to go into that it's not really great at, and that's like differentiating the sleep stages. So there's this whole craze about REM sleep right now, and people are like, oh, I got to get more REM sleep, and my watch said I got whatever amount of REM sleep, and it's really not great at, say, whether or not you're in deep sleep, versus REM sleep, versus light sleep. So I don't like it to be used for that purpose, and for certain individuals with chronic insomnia, again, there's such, this anxiety and stress around sleep that having too many details can cause more stress and anxiety. And so I think, if that is the case for you, I would be mindful and maybe not use it quite as much.

Kristyn Hogdon:
That's interesting about the REM sleep, because I was using the Ava bracelet for a little while for fertility, and it was giving me my REM percentage per night, and I didn't really know how to interpret that. So is there no real like percentage of the night that you're supposed to be in REM sleep? Or is it, just like you said, there's five different sleep cycles?

Dr. Angela Holliday-Bell:
Right, so you have N1 sleep, N2, N3, N-REM, so four major cycles. And you spent on average, you spend about 25% of the night in REM sleep, about 20% in deep sleep, and then most of your sleep is actually in the second stage of light sleep. But the reason you shouldn't really focus on this too much is that there's nothing I could do to say, tonight I'm going to get more REM sleep, tomorrow I'm going to get more. Your body will adjust the amount of time you spend in those sleep stages based on your needs. So, for instance, if you're very sleep deprived, your body will have what's called REM rebound, where it's jumping into REM sleep and giving you more of that because it feels that it's necessary to have that, but you don't have any control over that. The best thing you can do to ensure that you get the benefits of all the stages, because you need them all for different reasons, is to get good sleep consistently every night. Set yourself up for the best, sleep every night, and your body will determine how much of those cycles that you need. But there's not, besides, exercise can lead to more deep sleep and kind of general, things like that. There's nothing you can do to affect each stage each night. Like you just need to try to get good quality sleep, and your body will get into the stages that it needs to.

Kristyn Hogdon:
Yeah, I've been reading that kind of just being mindful of your circadian rhythm can really help with hormone balance in women too. I have PCOS, and so that's just been on my mind, and yeah, it really said, just being mindful of when you go to sleep and when you wake up and keeping it the same consistently.

Dr. Angela Holliday-Bell:
Exactly. All of those healthy habits will mean and translate into healthy sleep in all the stages. What is also helpful, but unfortunately, life is not set up that way for a lot of us, if you can work in alignment with your natural chronotype and circadian tendency as well. So I mentioned earlier, I'm naturally a night owl. If I was left to my own devices, I would go to sleep around 12 or 1 and wake up around 9 or 10, which is not set up for me though unfortunately, so I am constantly functioning in opposition to that. And so I have to be very strict about my schedule in order not to revert to my natural tendencies. But if I could work in more alignment with it, that's actually a healthier way to be because my body is, that's in my DNA, that's in my genetics, I can't really change that. I can manage in the best way possible, but I would function most optimally if I were able to align myself with that schedule. So if you have the ability to do that. Even if it's ..., you're an early bird and you prefer to start much earlier, trying to align your schedules and your sleep schedules with that Chronotype is also going to produce healthier benefits.

Kristyn Hogdon:
Perfect. So lastly, I always like to ask, what would you rescript about the way people think about sleep as it relates to their health?

Dr. Angela Holliday-Bell:
Yes. So I would, okay, I'm going to use a quote to illustrate this, and I explain, there's a quote by Nicola Hobbs who said, "instead of asking, have I worked enough to deserve to sleep, I've started asking, have I rested enough to do my best work?" And I think if people rescript it and reframe the way they thought about sleep, not to say it's this theme that I'll get to if I've done enough throughout the day, and once I've done all the other things, then whatever's left over, I'll sleep, and instead understand that sleep is necessary for you to function optimally in every facet and every role for you to be the best parent, wife, worker, whatever you want to be, sleep is actually necessary for all of those things. So instead of thinking of it as something that takes away from those roles, think of it as something that adds to them. Prioritize that, start your day with sleep in mind, and you'll see how much better you are at all the other things, how much more productive and efficient you are, how much, how better your relationships are because you're not on edge all the time. You have actual better regulation of your own emotions and your ability to understand others' emotions when you're getting adequate sleep. So if you reframe it that way, I think it will make a significant difference in your life.

Kristyn Hogdon:
I love that. My motto lately has been rest is productive.

Dr. Angela Holliday-Bell:
That's really the most productive thing you can do is just rest.

Kristyn Hogdon:
Yeah, so many of us just go, and it's okay to chill out and give your body what it needs sometimes. Thank you so much, Dr. Holiday-Bell. It's been such a pleasure.

Dr. Angela Holliday-Bell:
Thank you. Thank you so much for having me.

Kristyn Hogdon:
If this podcast means something to you, be sure to hit follow or subscribe. This helps you because you'll never miss an episode and it helps us because you'll never miss an episode. For everything you need to know about women's health and fertility, head to Rescripted.com or follow us on social at Fertility.Rescripted.

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